How to Turn Our Money Hang-ups Into Great Money Lessons for Our Kids
We're parents of neurodivergent kids. Of COURSE we worry about how they'll manage financially.
What Do You Want to Ask a Teen Money Mentor?
What questions do you have for a teen money expert who wants to help neurodivergent kids manage money?
Amanda L. Grossman isn't just an award-winning money expert with a passion for helping atypical kids manage their finances. She's walking alongside us, raising her own neurodivergent kid. Listen to the podcast, watch the YouTube video, or read the transcript below.
In this episode, she shares a "wealth" of expert financial literacy advice for neurodivergent kids and their parents. As a parent of a neurodivergent child, Amanda understands the challenges and stresses that come with raising our kids.
Her background includes being a certified financial education instructor and the founder of Money Prodigy, a platform that empowers children and teens to achieve financial independence. Featured on prominent sites such as Experian, Rockstar Finance, and Colonial Life, Amanda is on a mission to ensure every child grows up with the skills to manage their money confidently.
"You are good enough, and you should have the confidence to teach your child about money. I don't care if you're $150,000 in debt or more. Maybe you're living paycheck to paycheck, and maybe things aren't working out like you thought they would as an 8 year old. We've all been there."
-Amanda L. Grossman
We discuss the importance of sharing our personal money stories—warts and all—to make financial conversations less intimidating and more relatable for our children. We'll explore the pros and cons of allowances, paid chores, and the general responsibilities kids can take on within a family setting. Amanda has fantastic tips on using visual supports and categorizing chores to help our kids understand these concepts better.
We'll also discuss the delicate balance of allowing children the freedom to make their own spending decisions while setting boundaries and responsibilities to guide them.
For parents worried about their kids being too generous or feeling pressured to spend money on friends, Amanda offers thoughtful strategies to address these concerns. Plus, she’ll share her innovative approaches to making financial literacy accessible and engaging, from "money summer camp calendars" (below) to practical exercises in problem-solving and emotional regulation.
This episode will instill parents with confidence around teaching kids about money. Even if you never received a money education from your own parents, and maybe your finances aren't so great. You are perfectly suited for teaching your kids how to manage their money.
Get ready to rethink how you approach financial education at home!
At the end I'll guide you through an abundant breath to release any anxiety that may have arisen.
Amanda's gifts for listeners are designed to make money learning fun:
DIY Money Summer Camp Calendar - Teens
DIY Money Summer Camp Calendar - Kids
Connect with Amanda on moneyprodigy.com
Our mission for Mindfully Parenting Atypical Kids Podcast is to help parents of neurodivergent kids feel less alone. Kate interviews parents and experts who share her mission to co-create a more inclusive future. Our podcast needs your love to grow, so if you appreciate the strategies, connection, and support here, help it reach other parents! Please go to Apple Podcasts and give it an honest review:
Transcript:
Kate Lynch: Hi parents, what questions do you have for a teen money expert who wants to help neurodivergent kids manage money?
Are you feeling overwhelmed parenting your neuro divergent kids during these stressful times? Yeah, me too.
Welcome to Mindfully Parenting Atypical Kids, a neurodiversity affirming parenting podcast where you'll find connections, strategies, and support for your journey.
Amanda L. Grossman is a writer and a certified financial education instructor and founder of Money Prodigy. Featured on Experian, Rockstar Finance and Colonial Life, she's on a mission to help all children and teens grow up to be able to manage their money independently. She's also a parent of a neurodivergent kid.
Hi, Amanda.
Amanda Grossman: Hi everybody.
Kate Lynch: I'm so glad you're here. Thank you for joining us.
Amanda Grossman: Thank you so much for having me.
Kate Lynch: Do you want to talk a little bit about your mission and kind of just give us a little bit of background on what started you off down this path? Also why you want to help neurodivergent kids in particular.
Amanda Grossman: Absolutely. I started on my personal finance writer journey back in 2009 at the Houston Chronicle and I was a personal finance writer for adults. One of the things that really bothered me was that I was getting all of these emails from desperate adults who had gotten to the last rope in their finances where they were deciding between, do I pay for my health insurance or do I buy groceries this month? And each time I would try to get them some, help, send them to articles that I have, it felt like if somebody had gotten to them sooner, those dire circumstances wouldn't be there.
And so one day I got this divine download, from God, and felt really called to go into prevention rather than duct tape and band aid all the time. The prevention, I thought, was way back in childhood where I could actually make a difference and get to kids and teens and actually the parents and educators who are trying to teach their kids and teens, before they get into this really bad spiral and then are emailing people out of desperation. So I started money Prodigy in 2016 with the goal to help educators and parents be able to teach their kids how to manage money before their kids get their hands on a paycheck from like a real job job. Like when there's real money there.
Which is the mission. I thought if I can reach like a hundred thousand kids over several generations, that would be a million people whose lives I had changed and helped. Well, I've blown way past that, which is utterly blowing me away because at the time I thought a hundred thousand kids that would be amazing but in some way I have helped hundreds of thousands of kids and teens at this point and one thing that's especially laid in my heart is the lack of accessible financial literacy education resources. This really started laying heavy on me a couple of years ago. I've been down the rabbit hole before I even realized my own child is neurodivergent. So I wonder if there was actually some parallel going on. Slowly making the realization that my kid's a little bit different. And at the same time thinking there's no resources for, kids who are different and need different resources. So it's just really been on my heart to make my resources as accessible as possible, learn how to make those resources as accessible as possible. Because even though I have a child who's neurodivergent, I am not an expert in neurodivergency. I'm an expert in my child, but I'm still learning. That's what's led me to this point, and I'm just so excited to be here.
Kate Lynch: Thanks. Yeah. Even those of us who are neurodivergent in some way are still learning about ourselves and about being neurodivergent and about what supports we need.
I really loved the questions that you asked. And I think if more parents of neurodivergent kids, or neurodivergent parents, could, answer these questions could, speak up and give voice to those deep worries and insecurities and concerns around money.
I know for me, one of the things is like systemic inequity. And that's something that is hard to take care of in one podcast. Yes. So just naming that. And then the real fears that parents have navigating the systems. Especially I think of parents who know their kids won't be most likely, I mean it's hard to know when your kid is four, but as they get older and we start to see how independent they are developmentally and how their growth trajectory is in those areas, they might need support throughout their lifetime, even when we're gone. And I know that's a big fear for a lot of parents. One of my questions would be how much independence and how soon, and how do we know?
Amanda Grossman: With the subject of money, there's so many layers with the neurodivergent community and raising a child, because not only are you talking about like parents that are dealing with their own money issues trying to even just raise the child, trying to get past the fact that maybe they were never given a money education, with less confidence already. Now they're handed all of these other issues that they're like, I, maybe I knew how to do an allowance, but how do I do an allowance with a child who sees things differently?
And then the other layer to that is, what is my child capable of? I can't possibly put, a measurement on that at this point, what is my child's potential? What is their capability? How do I start the process of giving them a money education? How do I know where they are right now? So that I, and then what do I know what the next step is?
And truth be told, this is an issue for non neurodivergent Parents and kids. I'm just trying to figure out where is my kid right now and where can I take it from there? What's the road map?
Kate Lynch: Even with Neurotypical kids, there's not necessarily like an age based timeline, but especially with our divergent kids, that just goes out the window. Any kind of age based developmental milestones are not going to work with our kids.
Amanda Grossman: Yeah. I actually created this free checklist, money management skills checklist from the child standpoint, because I figured the child is going to grow up one day and need to be in charge of their own lives.
And so You want to know that they feel confident about these things, so they want to check off, I know how to write a check, not my child knows how to write a check . And what I made very clear in this checklist is it's not age based. It's very much stages and capability levels. Sometimes you can say, okay, about this age, like kids start thinking about needs versus wants. Or about this age, kids start saying I gotta buy these top notch sneakers because they're in that tweenie age and they're starting to think about their peers a lot more.
Kate Lynch: Let me stop you there, because I noticed that with my nieces. They're around the same age as Ocean. They have to have those Stanley Cups. And certain outfits. They are really cutting edge. They're 12 year old girls and, they may not be neurotypical, but socially they're in a different world.
Amanda Grossman: They want those things that are seen as social currency.
But then you look at Ocean. He's older than them and that's not happening.
Imagine like buckets, okay, like eventually kids get to this bucket where they're like caring more about money and you don't find it crumpled up in their bedroom anymore.
Eventually kids get to this bucket where, they're all into Branded stuff, whatever that means. It doesn't have to be the same thing as every kid, but they're really worried about their social currency and they really want to buy things that they probably wouldn't normally. So you can think about the buckets that your child is going to go through, but it's going to look different.
Within those buckets, I really want. Everyone to understand, like, it's going to look different. There's different time ranges and that is totally okay.
Kate Lynch: I know this is true for a lot of neurodivergent kids. Not really having this concept of what's appropriate generosity wise. He already offered to buy two of his friends tickets to the Pokemon Go Fest in New York City for the summer. Wow. That's something you should first ask them to ask their parents and then if their parents say yes, then if they can't afford it, sure.
Or if it's like a birthday gift, sure. But you can't just buy all your friends these tickets to this thing that are like, I don't know. Over 20.
Amanda Grossman: So I think the way that you started to approach it is good as far as Let's look at the responsibility here.
Did you ask their parents? There are different money rules in every household, right? And what's appropriate and not appropriate. And the other way that I would start talking to your child about that, because this is a problem. I've heard many parents say, Oh my gosh, my child gives their stuff away. I buy them things and they give them to friends and they're so frustrated. And I understand that. I've started having a conversation with my eight year old about reciprocity. Maybe they want to be very generous and they want to, or they want to gain friends. Maybe they think that, I can't have friends unless I give my things away or something like that.
You just want to start making them aware by asking so what has that friend done for you that made you think, I want to do this for them, or have they done anything for you? Not that they have to. You don't want to imply that they have to do, like for like, but if you start questioning, so what makes it about this friend that you want to give this to? How does it benefit you? Just to make their brain start working towards, why am I doing this? Let's make sure it's a pure reason. Do I feel good about reciprocity? As long as the child's aware of the fact that oh yeah, I gave them this, and then I gave them this, oh, and then I gave them this, oh, that's right, they haven't even returned something that they borrowed from me.
Oh, they haven't given me anything in return. And they just can start seeing that and being aware of it. I think as parents, one of our main jobs is just to make kids aware of things. They can work through it by themselves.
Kate Lynch: Yeah, I'm wondering. I'm definitely thinking about all that, but I don't think that any of it has to do with, for him, wanting to make friends or keep friends. He even said, if I can't buy things for my friends, what am I supposed to do with my money? It's really coming from a pure like generosity. And of course he wants to share this thing that he loves. With his friends.
Amanda Grossman: Absolutely. And that is a great quality, by the way. We're not trying to squash that quality, but we just, as parents, the fear is there, right?
Like, oh my gosh, my child is not going to be able to pay their rent one day because they have three freeloaders living on their couch. That's the fear, right?
Or they just give away all their money to some.
Asking some of these questions at least makes them aware so that if they are making those decisions from a pure place, they can be conscious of it.
And you bring up another really good point. What are the money responsibilities that Ocean has?
In a lot of households that don't have what I call a kid money system, what you want your child to learn about money, like how money is going to be governed in your household, the money rules, the money responsibilities. I find that there's just not the money boundaries set into place. You come up with them as you go along but then maybe not you just in general.
Not reinforcing them because you haven't really sat down to be intentional with it.
So the kid money system is It's just the good foundation that you can then have even more discussions. And then if there are these money responsibilities that your kid does have to pay for, that's going to change their relationship to their money. And one of those things might be, gee, if I keep buying, these tickets for my friends, I can't cover the 10 that I owe mom for, whatever money responsibility that I have over here.
That's when the trade offs start happening. And the reason why. I feel that money responsibilities are really important when you hand over any kind of money to a child is, in how money works and how the real world works. It's not normal to receive resources without any restraints on them at all.
Let's say you have a child who has a checking account. Would they ever be in a situation in life where they have a checking account full of all the money that they need for all of their needs and wants? No, that's not realistic. And so when you give an allowance or you pay chore commissions or however you want to give money in your household, if you pass that on without money responsibilities that they also have to pay for, you're setting up this like false way that the world doesn't really work. And that's when things can get out of balance.
Kate Lynch: Yeah. Good point. The only responsibility that we have so far is that two days a week he goes out to lunch. So he pays for his own lunch. So I'm like, you've got to make sure you don't spend it all because then you won't have money to buy yourself lunch and you'll have to eat school lunch.
Amanda Grossman: Not palatable for him. Yes. That is a perfect example of, I have my kid money system: however we get money into my child's hands. But I'm also passing on this money responsibility because he does have to have those thoughts now like, Oh, I want to feed myself on Wednesday and I don't want to have to pack a lunch from home. So he's already having those trade off conversations in his own head. So good job.
Kate Lynch: Well, thank you. I'll pat myself on the back.
Amanda Grossman: Pat yourself on the back.
Kate Lynch: So you had a cool strategy that you used with your son when he was younger. I guess you're still doing, and I loved the way you described it, that he has these challenges, anxiety, low frustration tolerance, which most of us can relate to even in ourselves.
And then what you did that changed things. Would you like to talk about that?
Amanda Grossman: Yeah, absolutely. So I was driving in the car. My son was, I think, four. And he gets these frustrations and he has these huge ideas and these big visions. And he is really good at actually taking action as well, which is awesome. He's not just all, vision and nothing else, but sometimes maybe like his fingers aren't as strong, so sometimes you can't physically build the thing that he wants to build.
I was just noticing these constant frustrations. And of course, when they're getting frustrated, especially driving, right, and they're just like, that noise! So all of a sudden it dawned on me. I said, you are a problem solver. What's a different way that you can think of to look at this problem? What's a different solution that you could come up with? Since he was only four at the time, it literally was like, what's one different thing that you could do or that you could try?
It was like instant that he stopped the whining, crying. You could see his brain start working. You know how they say for emotional regulation, your parents are the emotional regulation for the first, big part of your childhood.
It's like I was the outside person. Just here, try something different. And it just triggered it in him. And ever since then, I try to say, look at the situation, look at what he's frustrated in, and I don't jump right in anymore.
Mostly. I'm not an angel, it doesn't always happen, right?
I just say, remember, you're the problem solver. What's the problem here? So that he can just, Calm his mind down enough to say it's can't do this or this won't work or these two things won't go together Or I want to do this big thing but it looks really unsafe and all of these different things. And then I could say oh What's one different way you can try that what's one different thing you can try and almost inevitably when?
When he thinks, not only does it calm him down, but then when he tries the different thing, it branches off into maybe something different. So it's not like that might be the actual solution, but it starts this cascading, wonderful thing that you're like, yes, yes. Instead of it just spiraling down. He feels much more in control as a problem solver, and it also normalizes it.
This is what I do with money as well, because, what is managing money if not a lifetime of problems that you have to work through? One after the other.
Even if the problem is figuring out how to spend money. Even if the problem is like figuring out how to pay the bills when they're due so that they're not late. Like these are all problems that we solve all the time. When you recount it as, I'm raising a money problem solver.
Then it's Ooh, and it also puts kids in that more confident position already. It normalizes it. I mean, I do this. I'm sure other people do this as well. When we have our own problems or when we have money mistakes or money problems, we tend to think it's just me. There is something about me.
Like I'm doing this thing that's wrong. I don't know what I'm doing. But in fact, we all have these money problems and we all make money mistakes. So it just normalizes the process of identify what's frustrating you. What is the issue? And then, yeah, you can actually choose. You can choose different things to try.
Since you're still in whatever your household looks like, it's more of a safe environment for you to try these things instead of when you're 27 and trying to figure out how to pay the mortgage.
Kate Lynch: Yeah, and hopefully you have a limited amount to spend. Even if Ocean bought those tickets he would have to do it on a debit card that isn't going to overdraft, so he might not even have enough.
Amanda Grossman: Built in money training wheels, is what I call them.
Kate Lynch: Oh, I like that.
Amanda Grossman: Yeah, and one of the biggest complaints, we see what our kids are spending their money on, and we're like, my, Gosh, that's a waste!
Oh my gosh it's almost like we see the money as an extension of our own, because most of the times we're the source of the money, right? either through an allowance, through chore commissions, through birthday money, whatever, we're the source of it, and we continue, this is my money, and how can you possibly spend it?
Because kids are spending it according to their values, and their wants, not ours. So, what I like to remind parents is, let them make those money mistakes, if they even are, now, while it's like, a 50 mistake, a 20 mistake, a 15 mistake. You don't want them making like the 1, 500 mortgage dollar mistake or you don't want them making like those huge mistakes that could potentially one day be like, I'm back on your couch now because I'm making these mistakes.
Allow them to make those mistakes and mentor them through with questions that bring awareness to what were you not what were you thinking, but Oh what were your thoughts on? Like, why did you choose this way versus this way? More neutral and then build that awareness of their own agency, their own ability, their own control within the situation.
Kate Lynch: I love that. It sounds like a extension of growth mindset, like mistakes make us better when we learn from them. Mistakes are how we grow.
Amanda Grossman: Absolutely. Think about, I, I get parents who are freaking out because my child's 18 and I just found your website. Oh my gosh, I wish I had this when I was five.
And my whole thinking there is like, how many of us had to learn our money education the hard knocks way in our twenties, right? And we did. We learned. Not saying that we're perfect or anything, but you can continue learning at any age. It's not like you've missed the window. There's still time. If your kid's 25, there's still time. Like I was still learning about money in my twenties and look where I am at this point, so it's not like, Oh my gosh, my child's 10, and we've never gotten money into their hands.
That's fine. Start from here going forward. Here's where we build some sort of roadmap.
Kate Lynch: Right. That sounds great. And if your kid is living at home, no judgment there.
Amanda Grossman: No, no judgment. I'm, I shouldn't have said it that way. I'm talking about the one college graduated, no plans, no idea what they want to do with their life.
Never put any thought into it. And now because of that, now they're living on mommy and daddy's couch. That's what I meant by that comment. Yes, absolutely. If children are living at home and there's like a plan and an intention and a reason, Go for it. That's fantastic.
Kate Lynch: Or if they just need a little extra time to figure things out.
Amanda Grossman: Absolutely.
Kate Lynch: Yeah. It's better if it's not like some completely avoidable disaster that ended them back.
Amanda Grossman: Yeah, when parents do have their adult children living with them, there has to be some sort of a point where there's now new boundaries in place, right? Different money boundaries, different life boundaries, right? Because the child is no longer a child and is at different stages, different abilities, different, everything. In order for them to continue the growing while at home, there needs to different boundaries and things in place.
Kate Lynch: Yeah, and I love your point that it's really never too late.
So would you like to ask me some of the questions that you had sent? I could try to answer them. I, I also want to invite listeners to consider these questions as well. Let us know what your answers are.
Amanda Grossman: I'm literally a money nerd. I love listening to people's answers to these kinds of questions and just learning more about it. So my first question that I asked is, when you think of teaching your child about money, this is either a kid or a teenager.
What do you think about doing? What is that in your mind when I say, oh, I need to teach my child about money?
Kate Lynch: When I think of starting the process of teaching my kid about money, I think of this is a penny, right? It's worth one cent. This is a nickel. It's worth five cents. That's how we started. Ocean was really counting.
Amanda Grossman: Absolutely. And so when you see your child now when you think, Oh, I got to teach my child about money, what is it that you think should happen there?
Kate Lynch: Well this year we did get him a debit account and a debit card mainly because I was so tired of always having to have cash on hand. I'm really not a very cash oriented person.
Yeah. And I work mostly from home. So I'd have to go out and find an ATM, get him cash. And there was always some drama. So I just opened an account for him, got him this debit card. And I thought it would be a really good way for him to learn about using it responsibly.
And it wasn't that long ago that he wasn't comfortable going up to the register and, using a debit card himself or even buying things. He always wanted me to do it. And even still, when I'm there, he doesn't, he would prefer not to interact with shopkeepers. And, like he's gotten really used to going to Burger King because it's nearby and he loves it.
And they're really nice there. They know him. But with other places, he's he's less familiar. So it's just a way for him to spread his wings, push his boundaries that little bit and get familiar with new ways of. interacting.
Amanda Grossman: Yeah, absolutely. It increases his agency with money as well. Yes.
Okay. So what access to money does your child have? So you said that he has a debit card at this point. Does he, is the debit card tied to a checking account? Does he have access to the checking account? I'd assume it's a custodial situation.
Kate Lynch: Yeah, it's a special account. The way I set it up is that it automatically comes out of our joint account a certain amount every week.
Okay. Which is about what we think is the top that he should be spending on those out to lunch trips twice a week. Now, since he has more agency, it's interesting. His lunch bill has been getting smaller and smaller.
Amanda Grossman: I was just going to ask if he figured out yet, Oh, if I like maybe pack lunch from home, then I can spend the money on something else.
Kate Lynch: No, he loves going out to lunch. It's like his favorite thing about school. He used to go to Dunkin Donuts and get this, that, this, that, you know, and maybe not finish it all, but like all the different tastes and also buy a friend lunch. Something about the cash. Then we would see, oh, you still have 10 left. You only need this much for lunch tomorrow. So now that he knows every single week, the same amount is going in, the wheels are turning and he's Oh, but if I, don't spend that, I can buy a toy,
Amanda Grossman: which is fantastic.
That is you've created. An environment where a natural money lesson is being self discovered by a child. This is what I talk about all the time. It's really great to see.
Kate Lynch: He does do things like buy himself Gatorade before school, and that is not according to my values. But at this point, I feel like I've got to just let it go.
I can't police what he's going to, if I'm giving him that freedom, that agency, I can't really police what he's going to spend it on. I can ask him, how did you feel after drinking that?
Amanda Grossman: Sure. And what I would just say to that is if you do come to a point where Cause this happens to all of us where your kids are making purchases that like, that's not jiving with my value as a parent.
Like my integrity as a parent, not saying the Gatorade is, but if you get to that point, that's money rules. So when you're handing over money, you would have a discussion at some point first with yourself. And if you have a spouse with your spouse, but what are the money rules?
Like we're handing this money over, but these are the things that you're not actually allowed to do with that money. That's when you would start thinking about that and just being more proactive building that into your kid money system.
Kate Lynch: Yeah. Yeah. I'm more concerned about him spending it all on Robux or
Amanda Grossman: something then.
There you go. So you could even have a maximum spending threshold before you have to get our approval set in. Yeah.
Kate Lynch: I think we might have that.
Amanda Grossman: So there's lots of ways to just, tweak your system.
Okay you talked about this a little bit. The third question was, what does your child do with the money in their lives?
So you talked about Gatorade, he's buying lunches instead of having to pack his lunch. Sometimes he's giving it away to friends or to have friends be able to come with him to events. But do you know of any other things that your child's doing with their money?
Kate Lynch: Yeah, if he saved up a bit, he'll buy himself a game or a toy.
Amanda Grossman: Okay, nice.
Kate Lynch: Yeah, that's about it. Yeah, snacks after school. It's mostly snacks and like the out to lunch days.
Amanda Grossman: Awesome. Okay. And then this is the potentially really juicy one, even though I found all of those very juicy. Thank you for answering those.
What do you secretly get scared about when it comes to your child about money? What are the things that wake you up at three in the morning and you just think, oh my gosh, if it has to do with your child and money?
Kate Lynch: That someone will take advantage of him.
Amanda Grossman: Okay. And that's born out of that just generous, overly generous nature you've seen with money so far?
Kate Lynch: Actually, like I said, like when you had said that there was that that possibility of like reciprocity and people taking advantage of you or needing to spend to keep a friend or something, I think that's more of something I experienced when I was his age, this one friend who wasn't the nicest person and was cooler than me. Our family did not have a lot of money and I used to actually find the change to spend it on school lunch and stuff.
And she would be demanding give me a dollar or something and I have that feeling like I couldn't say no until I finally did blow up and storm off or whatever. But for sure. Yeah. So I think it's more of my projection, to be honest. Okay.
Amanda Grossman: And I think it's always such a great exercise with just yourself or with a partner to actually talk about your money hangups that you still have from childhood because those are where a lot of our values are now.
And it's just so helpful even as partners to understand each other better as far as like, why do they think we have to pay for chores. There's different things that each of us are like, no, no, no. And it usually comes from an experience that we've had or a way that we felt about money.
Maybe the socioeconomic background that we came from. Um, I grew up on a dairy farm. We did not have much money at all. And so I can understand and relate to a lot of what you're talking about.
Kate Lynch: Yeah.
Amanda Grossman: And not only does it help you and potentially your partner to get on the same page and to understand each other better, but these now become fantastic, teachable money moments and stories for you to bring up with your child. And kids and teens don't necessarily like being preached to, am I right? But if you couch it in a story sometimes like oh my gosh when I was a kid like I had this friend this girl and at first it was like really cool And I thought Wow.
Cause she's cooler than I was, or at least I thought that at the time. And so I was totally fine with giving her money here and there and we got to do stuff together and that was really cool. And then I started to feel a little off about it. I thought, why, you can just kind of like build your own story around who you are.
What happened, which in turn is, kind of good therapy for yourself as well. Yeah. But it can pass on something to your child that they think, Oh, okay, maybe I should think about this differently. Or they might just ask you questions and it's just a really good way to have a money conversation without it being like, you shall not do this.
Kate Lynch: Yeah. I'm a big fan of Dr. Becky. Have you heard of Dr. Becky?
Amanda Grossman: Oh yeah, I just found her about six months ago or so. She's great.
Kate Lynch: Yeah, I'm in her membership and I went through the mentorship program and I'm a club leader. I love what she says about telling little stories that don't have a moral. That we didn't necessarily do the perfect right thing that teaches them a lesson, but just leave it hanging in the air so that they feel less alone.
Amanda Grossman: I think that's fantastic. Yeah. Yeah.
Kate Lynch: So I actually told him something about that, something similar to that story. And I actually told him how I took all the coins, threw them on the ground in the hallway in the high school in ninth grade.
And, they went everywhere and I stormed off and just left it at that. He's like, well, then what? I'm like, I don't even remember. I didn't give her money anymore.
Amanda Grossman: That's the first time I've heard that part of Dr. Becky, but what comes to mind as to why I feel like that would be really like great to do is because I don't know about you, but I usually treat other people better or I think they deserve to be treated better, especially people that I love. If I were going to end a story without giving him like exactly what happened. Maybe he would be like, that should never have happened to her. How did that happen? She shouldn't have given her money to that woman. Like change their thinking and then they can see the lesson. So that's really interesting. Thanks for sharing.
Kate Lynch: Sure. And her whole thing is to not leave them alone in whatever it is that they're going through.
Amanda Grossman: Yeah. I've always told parents, and educators too, to mine your money mistakes. We have all I have made money mistakes. That's how I learned, right? Like we've all made money mistakes. If you can grab like a couple of those money mistakes and just talk to your kid. Oh my gosh, this one time, I overpaid or I got this overdraft charge and I didn't know that this happened. And then.
Those money mistakes are fodder for these money conversations that once you open up these money conversations with your kid could probably blow your mind. When you get your kid in that certain, I know you know what I'm talking about because I see you shaking your head.
It's like the conversation flows better, the things that they bring up and the insights, the questions they have, it's just, it's mind blowing. And so I think one of the ways to get there is just to be really vulnerable and say, I got into debt, like, 13, 000 doing this thing.
And then they'll be like, what do you mean? How did you do that? How did you even have 13, 000?
Kate Lynch: I am much more open and vulnerable with my kid than my partner is my partner kind of wants to protect him from the worries. Yeah, sure. So we go back and forth that way.
We both grew up with food insecurity. And, he grew up in a bigger family and didn't have enough to buy him stuff. So he loves buying stuff for ocean. And sometimes I push back. That makes me uncomfortable because of my own concerns. I don't think he'll be spoiled. It's not that, but it's like focusing too much on the material as a way to share love and we all have different ways of showing our love. Yes. That's not mine. That's where things are a little different, like you said, to sit down and have those conversations, with your partner or with the whole family and come up with those money guidelines or rules.
So Amanda, I'm going to ask you this question that I got when I put this out to a group of parents of neurodivergent kids on Facebook.
“Would you talk about allowances and paid chores and general pitching in? Because the family is a community that works together. My kid is very transactional and it's hard to get buy in on community spaces. We worry about reinforcing ‘I will only do this if I get something that feels super concrete and tangible.’”
What advice do you have for this parent?
Amanda Grossman: Off the top of my head, if they're very transactional in nature, taking yourself out of the moment when they're like demanding to be paid for certain things because it's never going to come off well then. Being proactive a little bit and saying, okay, I'm going to come up with a list of chore tasks and chore projects, and we pay for chore projects.
Kate Lynch: What's the difference?
Amanda Grossman: So chore tasks I see as simple things and more personal responsibilities, like things in your room that need to be done or taking your dishes off of the kitchen table and putting them in the dishwasher. Things like that that are just more personal responsibility versus, and I'll just give you a couple of examples. Cleaning out the family car or cleaning out the front hall closet.
Now those are big chore projects that are, further along, but off the top of my head, those are the ones that I could think of. You can certainly come down from that.
I do have an article on 100 chore ideas for around the house and I do break it down into chore tasks versus chore projects. So you can get a lot more examples and break down what you feel like you should pay for or not pay for.
But I do find it helpful because my son can be certainly categorical about things and by categorizing things, setting this up ahead of time. These are the buckets that these live in. There's a lot less back and forth.
It's almost like they're comforted because they know where things lie. We can ahead of time have that kind of figured out. Maybe try that.
Kate Lynch: Visual supports are so great for now. Yes. Yeah. And where would taking out the recycling go into that?
Amanda Grossman: We'll see that's entirely up to you. That's what makes it so great. In my mind, a chore project, any project has more than one task involved in it.
So something like taking out the recycling. If you take out the trash, you have to take out the trash and then put a new bag in, I'm just giving this as an example. So it's like a two step thing there, especially if you have a younger kid. With recycling, you just, bop it into the trash can.
I don't know if that makes a difference within your household or not, but it's also a gut thing, right? In your gut, how does it feel to pay your child to do recycling? Versus to have them load up the dishwasher or something like that and you can do gut decisions because this is your house. You get to make those rules.
Kate Lynch: In ours, we really don't do it that way. I do say this is your responsibility and these are your chores and we all contribute to the household, but I haven't attached it to the money also because that money is to feed him. And I feel like that's our responsibility.
Amanda Grossman: Yeah. So you're having him pay for a borderline need, which as your child gets older, I recommend that. So that's great. But as you're saying, it's like you, you have a responsibility to cover needs.
So you do have to make sure that there's enough money for that. And then if there's once on top of that, that becomes a little more working with.
Kate Lynch: So Amanda, what do you want to be remembered for?
Amanda Grossman: I've been interested in and working with money since I've been like probably a young teenager and just always been fascinated with the subject. I've never been at a point where I actually don't feel confident about money. And yet there are so many things else in my life that I understand and feel that non confidence.
And so I have really made it my mission to instill that confidence in other people that are in the parenting and educating roles that You can do this. No matter what your finances look like right now, your child is not here in adult financial world. Your child is here in their context, in their world.
And you are very capable from where you are right now, to meet them there. to answer those questions, and it doesn't have to be scary. You can do that. You just need some guidance, some resources and your own intuition, your own money mistakes, stories, but you got this.
I want people to be like, she made me feel like I could do it.
Kate Lynch: Great. And what would you say your core values are, especially related to parenting?
Amanda Grossman: Becoming a parent has certainly been the biggest growth journey of my life. This is especially true with, neurodivergent kids. I feel that I was given my own set of glasses to look through to see my child. And that's different than how the world views him and how everyone else views him. And I'm going to continue wearing those glasses. I understand him. I feel that it is our duty and our jobs as parents to advocate for our children because we know them at such a cellular level, to create space for them to become who they are, which we don't even know exactly what they're going to become, but to have that space there And to mentor and facilitate and guide rather than dictate. With some good boundaries and rules in place, of course.
Kate Lynch: Yeah, I love that. Thank you. Thanks for asking. So you got this.
Amanda Grossman: Yeah, absolutely.
Kate Lynch: I'm wondering if there's anything else that's coming up for you that you would like to make sure that we tell parents.
Amanda Grossman: I think the one thing that I always try to instill in other parents as much as possible is that you are good enough and you should have the confidence to teach your child about money.
And I don't care if you're 150, 000 in debt or more. Maybe you're living paycheck to paycheck and, maybe things aren't working out like you thought they would as an eight year old. We've all been there. Your money mistakes, your openness to the mentorship process.
Making your child aware of their money decisions within their context and their world makes you completely suitable to teach your child how to manage their money. You're perfectly situated and suited for it. And I just always want to leave parents with that vote of confidence because so many of us did not receive a money education and that has really shaped, usually not in good ways, the adult experience with money. We don't want to pass those money hangups as much as we can onto our kids, but rather we can use those money hangups and use those mistakes to have those conversations and build a kid money system that we can be proud of. We can start seeing these money lessons naturally be discovered by our child just by the way we set up our own system, which is really exciting as you've experienced some yourself.
Kate Lynch: Totally. Talking about money, I'm noticing in my body and in my gut, especially talking about childhood triggers, that anxiety arises.
So if you're willing, let's do a couple of belly breaths and then we'll see if anything else comes up.
Put a hand on your belly. You don't have to close your eyes unless you want to. If you're driving, don't close your eyes. And relax your belly. Have that sense of abundance. Imagine a Buddha belly. Let your breath start to fill your belly. Take it in, and when you breathe out, let it go slow, make a sound with your breath, and let your waist draw toward your spine. You can breathe out through your nose or your mouth, it doesn't matter. So inhale, fill up your belly as best you can.
Make a sound on your exhale.
Right at the end, feel that drawing in of your waist. Expel the last bit of breath out. Then relax your belly one more time. Buddha belly. Fill it up like a balloon. And deflate the balloon.
I feel a little less anxious. I hope you do too.
I just want to remind parents again to answer those questions. I'll make sure I have them in the show notes as well as the summer calendar and ways to reach Amanda.
Amanda thank you so much for your time. So grateful.
And you have something that you want to give to listeners, right?
Amanda Grossman: Yes. Yeah. So summer's coming up.
It will be here before we know it. So I created these money summer camp calendars for June, July, and August. I have one set for kids and one set for teens. You're welcome to choose. Maybe you choose both . And it's something for kids to, do each day on there. Some of the activities you might love. Some of the things you're like, eh, and you just cross it off. It gives you something to say, oh yeah, did you do your money activity for today?
It's something quick. Do that over the summer and see what conversations come up just from that.
Kate Lynch: That sounds fun. Yeah. Yeah, I love thinking about money education as being fun and doable.
Amanda Grossman: Where you can find everything is money prodigy. com.
Kate Lynch: Thank you.
Amanda Grossman: Thank you so much. I love having these conversations.
I don't know if you noticed, but I can't stop smiling.